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[speedpacket]

... or not!

Hello everyone!
We're currently online from our Empire State Club room at the Hotel New York, and I was about to post pictures here from the rooms, as so many people that already booked, or were interested in seeing what the rooms look like, requested for someone to post pictures on several occasions...

I'm disappointed to say, however, that I don't need to post any pictures, as the rooms are exactly the same as the regular rooms in the hotel, and definitely not worth the price we paid.

I'm sor sorry to say that with over 10.000 EUR spent at the resort only this year, and over 60.000 the past five years, I'm worried that the next few years might just be a little less expensive for us, Disney-wise.

We've always been great fans of the resort, coming here since 1992, but the way they have been ripping us off now, is simply not acceptable to any hotel!

Considering that we are paying the same rates as some of the other 5 star hotels in Paris, we're not getting any service here at all...  No-one to take up our luggage to the room, not a simple bottle of water or coffee-making facilities in the rooms, the lounge reserver for empire state club members closes before you get back after park closing hours, so you don't get the advertised free included beverages, and best of all...  Even though we reserved lake view (or at least we were told this room would be lake view), we're seeing nothing but a nice parking lot from our window...

People on the board know I've always been a huge Disney fan, defending some of their pricing strategies, but this, combined with the recent price increases of an average 20% on all merchandis is making me think twice...

Oh - and if people are interested: Crush's coaster is not testing fastpass this weekend; tests will begin monday and last until next sunday, according to the cast member onsite

Cheers
David.

[Elaine]

Did you ask to be moved to a lakeview room, or were there none available?

How did the rest of your "perks" go for the Empire State Club? Did you get VIP fastpass, character breakfast? Is check-in any better over the usual HNY room procedure? Are there any other perks for paying the extra for Empire State Club?

Elaine

[Epcot_Boy]

emmm.........That sounds, well dissapointing, to say the least

I have been hearing some poor reports lately regarding the New York, which is a shame because it is a lovely hotel.

I recently paid the extra for an Admirals floor room at the Newport, and even though I love the hotel, I'm not really sure that the extra cost was worth it :roll:

I think DLRP need to review what they offer when charging extra for these more 'Up Market' rooms. A free cup of coffee really doesn't hack it..... :x

Epcot_Boy :ears:

[speedpacket]

Hello again...

Thanks for replying to the topic.  First of all - I need to correct my figures.  Not that it matters, but we spent 40.000 last 5 years, not 60.000 - sorry about that mistake.

Secondly.  The first post we made was on saturday morning, before leaving for breakfast.  Although one of the perks says you're getting your character dinner, I must say that this character dinner is nothing you can compare to what they are doing at DLH for instance.  When we were there, we only got pluto for about 15 minutes, and nothing for the rest.  Also - since you are in a very small room, there is only about 15 other people in the same room, so Pluto got pretty bored himself having to run through the area for a full 15 minutes...

Furthermore, elaborating on the breakfast...  It's not our first time experience with HNY, so we can compare, but the breakfast in the Empire State Club doesn't even come near to what they offer downstairs to the other guests.  If they charge these amounts, you should be able to expect at least the same amount of food choices for your breakfast.  In stead - again, I blame this to the room that is too small - the choices are VERY limited, and you don't get ANY service.  I know for one that in DLH (not even castle club), they came to our table to serve coffee and tea; even that seems to be too much to ask for at the Empire State Club.

Basically, and this has been confirmed by some of the cast members I spoke to, I believe that due to the high demands there seems to be for the Castle Club rooms at DLH, they wanted to fill the gap between Castle Club and Admiral's Floor, so reservations can advise Empire State Club when Castle Club is fully booked, but they didn't think about this thoroughly.

I spoke to the manager on duty friday evening, and he simply waived all our complains away, as if I was expecting the impossible from a hotel that "only charges 509 EUR per night per room".  When we left on sunday however, I wanted to throw out a little fish so they would bite, so I went to the reception again to ask for the address where we could send our letter of complaint to.  Although I had that information already, I was hoping they were clever enough to get in another manager that would hear us out, and they actually did.  This guy, Clive, appeared to be much more aware of the issues with the Empire State Club, and actually agreed to most if not all issues that we communicated to him.

Basically, and it really really does hurt me to write this on the forum, I have never felt more disappointment when visiting Disney than we did this weekend.

We were really looking forward to a great weekend, but unfortunately, it turned out to be our worst Disney experience ever.  Last Halloween, we booked a suite and four connecting rooms at HNY.  We were planning on doing the same for this year, but I think we'll drastically change plans, and not go to Disney at all.  If they actually believe they can get away with treating their guests like this, I sincerely hope this is not a sign of what else is to come for the next 15 years...

Also - we never ate at the buffet restaurant at HNY, but in case anyone did - does anyone actually believe this is even worth being in such an up-market hotel?!?  We wanted to try out the Manhattan restaurant and give its Italian cuisine a go, but much to our surprise, on a very busy saturday, this was closed!  Well, if you are charging your guests 500+ EUR, why would Disney think they can pull it off to put these guests in something like that over-noisy, disorganised, service-lacking Buffet "restaurant"?  

I know it must seem like I'm overacting now, and over-dramatising, but we've always been huge fans, have over 50 Disney Classics Collections Figurines, our house has Disney paintings on the walls, we used to go to Disney an average of once - twice a month, and never hesitated to book some of the more expensive rooms at DLH, HNY or NPBC, but this weekend simply killed all the magic for me.  They'll have to throw in big stuff to ever regain my trust again, as DLRP and us had a a long relationship that they managed to destroy in just three days.

Again: very disappointing, and while we probably were the best ambassadors for DLRP amongs our friends and other social networks, we might just have turned into the worst.  I hope I'll be able to turn my gut feeling again, but I never felt worse about them than I do now.

So please do apologise me if you believe I'm over-dramatising things...

I'm just so lucky that we didn't bring friends this time...

[Kristof]

We've always been great fans of the resort, coming here since 1992, but the way they have been ripping us off now, is simply not acceptable to any hotel!

I'm really sorry you feel this way, but didn't you get what you ordered (besides the Lake View which you're right about)?  I don't want to sound rude at all, but you knew the list and you knew what you were going to pay for it?  

I hope you did complain at the reception, so you could get some compensation?

The official list of privileges for Empire State Club, as communicated by DLRP:

• Personalised welcome area exclusive for Empire State Club
• Continental Buffet Breakfast in a private lounge with Disney Character(s)
• Exclusive in-room services with dedicated staff
• VIP FASTPASS for all guests
• Relaxation area with free soft drinks
• Possibility to book interconnecting rooms (upon request and subject to availability)

[speedpacket]

Well Kristof,

We've spoken to eachother before, and as you very much know, I've always been a BIG defender of Disney, but when they screw up, they screw up, and to me, their Empire State Club offer is possible the biggest mistake ever.

• Personal welcome area

--> received it, but a hotel like this should at least offer you to take the bags for you and not just instruct us to take our bags, and follow his lead.

• Continental breakfast

Great!  Just very strange that the breakfast is only about half what you get downstairs.  Pay more, get less?  Not for me, thank you.  We ended up getting breakfast downstairs sunday morning...

• Exclusive in-room services with dedicated staff.

Considering it took 20 minutes to get roomservice up for just a coke and a bottle of water at about 11.45 pm, with the limited rooms on the floor, I like to believe I can seriously doubt the dedicatedness of the staff on the club...

• VIP fastpass

If this is what is worth the 509 EUR, well then they should just start selling them seperately.  VIP fastpass is not THE reason why we come to a Disney hotel, and certainly does not make it all worthwhile.  By the way - we often don't like using the VIP fastpass if you're there for 3+ days; what fun is there to do ToT 25 times, BTM 25 times etc if you go the times we do

• Relaxation area

As said, it closes if before park closure, so...

• Interconnecting rooms

Not applicable to this reservation.


All of this however, Kristof, doesn't matter.  Just broaden your horizon, and look at what other hotels with 5* ratings offer for the same or even lower price, and you'll soon notice that the Empire State Club is nothing more than a way to make more money.  They'll soon understand that it's their biggest mistake though, because if you have customers used to book Castle Club, and reservations offers them Empire State Club as an alternative because Castle Club is fully booked, I can definitely guarantee you that they will feel very much the same way we felt.

For this price, the minimum you can expect is

• some bottle of water in the room or coffee/tea making facilities.
• a manager on duty not just ignoring your discomforts with the stay
• some guy with decent training knowing when to offer luggage service
• get the room that you ordered through reservations when you did (lake view)
• get CLEAN towels (sorry, I didn't mention this before)
• get Soap (second day without soap?!?)
• get two bathrobes (why just one?!?)

I'm very sorry, Kristof, but if you look at my previous posts, and how I always defended Disney when people started whining about pricing strategies, I very much defended them in the same way that I will now defend my feeling that this is the most disappointing stay ever, and that they really should reconsider the offer...

I hope you don't think of this post as being attacking or rude, as this is not my intention, but I feel somewhat misunderstood by you, and if you look up myprevious posts, you will soon notice that I'm right


Cheers!
David.

[pussinboots]

You have my sympathy, David. I felt the same way about the Admiral's Floor at the Newport Bay Club (tiny room, dumpy public areas, broken ice maker and view of parking lot -- this is worth an extra heap of money how?). Thanks for the warning.

Kristof -- With luxury experiences, you can't really justify things with lists. You can't have a five star hotel (which the Hotel New York isn't, but I'm trying to illustrate a point here) and offer room service but have peeling wallpaper, or offer complimentary bottled water and not have staff that will carry people's bags. It's about the whole package. It's what people expect for what they pay, and rightfully so. It's pretty undeniable that the Empire State Club stops short.

[speedpacket]

You can't have a five star hotel (which the Hotel New York isn't, but I'm trying to illustrate a point here)

Well - exactly my point.
Either offer five star service, or stop charging five star prices

Thanks for your sympathy...  It's much appreciated, as I was just talking about it to my girlfriend, and I was getting a bit afraid of becoming too demanding, but as we have been fortunate enough to being able to stay ay the Ritz and Le Grand (Intercontinental) in Paris for less than what we paid at HNY, and for far better service!

And yes - a few years ago we had the same bad experience with Admiral's Floor, which is why we stopped going there...  They really should reconsider their strategy urgently.

Oh - and in case you didn't know - the 509 EUR we paid is room only; no entrance tickets included...  It's just plain and simply ridiculous, whatever lists they advertise.  The Ritz or any other five star hotel don't publish a list of just normal to be expected service on their sites either, really...

And lastly - we were really amazed to learn that they didn't even have a first aid or pharmacy service at the hotel?!?  My girlfriend had a terrible headache so I called concierge to see whether we could get a painkiller, but they just referred me to the First Aid Center at Central Plaza in Disneyland Park...

Honestly: I have always been such a big fan, but if you consider all these issues, I can't understand that people can catually be satisfied with the hotel's offerings

[roaldbergmann]

Wow! What a bomber! :-( I'm so sorry to hear about your stay. I'm very thankful though, that you're honest and just to "happy as long as it's Disney". And maybe it's about time, that we speak up and try and force them to deliver some better goods. Actually as you describe it, it sounds like a Michael Eisner-strategy: As long as it's got the Disney-brand, the fans will pay the bucks". And you definitely SHOULD be demanding. It would take me about half a year, to gather the money for a hotel stay as the one you had - and my expectations would be MILE high.

I feel a bit depressed now..... :-(

[smurfy74]

Sorry if any of this sounds rude its not meant to be. You keep going on how much the room cost, fair enough but why don't you just book a normal room in one of the other hotels and spend your money in one of the park restaurants or village restaurants in the evening, i understand what u say about the price and comparison to a ritz room etc. but i have never understood the desire to spend all that money on some where im going to mostly sleep in, as i would really like spend most of my time in the park. i do agree you should get great service for that money but im not sure why you would want to spend that kind of money on a room in the first place unless its for a really special occasion ( then if i had spent 500+ euros i would be annoyed) . its somewhere to sleep at the end of the day. At the end of the day its not that bad, there are far worse things in the world like cancer and poverty, you are lucky as we all are that we can go to somewhere like Disney, but i do hope you get some compensation for the bad experience

[speedpacket]

Not sure where that would fit in the picture, really.
Some people spend 8.000 EUR on their car; others pay 50.000 EUR.  Should those that pay the 50k not have the right to demand what would need to be expectable for such a price?  Or would you also say - why not take the 8k version, as all you really do is drive in them?

Luxury items are sold for all kinds of goods...  Be it food, means of transportation, cameras or places to sleep.

I get your point, as we also stayed at Holiday Inn on several occasions as well, but that is just not the topic in this thread...

[PetiteSirene]

In all fairness Speedpacket your talking about the hotel as if its 5 star... but to my understanding its not.

I have been to loads of hotels all over Europe. Only 2 have ever delivered my luggage to my room, both of those were 5 star (Marriott Brussels and the 5 star deluxe Don Pedro in Lisbon)

Its a sad that you paid so much, but just because its a Disney Hotel you shouldnt expect a 4 star to compare to a 5 star no matter what the price is. At the end of the day you got everything on that list.

I can understand you might be upset that it wasnt what you expected from the price you paid, but glass no matter how finely cut is still glass, you cant just make it into a diamond.

[smurfy74]

i get your point but you did get everything that was 'special' for the room type you got ( apart from the view ), if i bought a luxury car and it didnt have feature x but it wasnt on the spec list then i wouldnt complain. where i think the fault lies is that you were given an impression that you were going to get something similar to the castle club which didnt materialise. its a great shame in business where something is hyped to be something it isnt as you are then going to get disappointed customers, this is where i feel you have been let down. at work im always reminded to under promise and over deliver , never over promise and under deliver as that is a terrible customer experience. i really hope you do get some compensation.

[pussinboots]

In all fairness Speedpacket your talking about the hotel as if its 5 star... but to my understanding its not.

I have been to loads of hotels all over Europe. Only 2 have ever delivered my luggage to my room, both of those were 5 star (Marriott Brussels and the 5 star deluxe Don Pedro in Lisbon)

Its a sad that you paid so much, but just because its a Disney Hotel you shouldnt expect a 4 star to compare to a 5 star no matter what the price is. At the end of the day you got everything on that list.

I can understand you might be upset that it wasnt what you expected from the price you paid, but glass no matter how finely cut is still glass, you cant just make it into a diamond.

That's a fair point -- you can't expect a four star hotel to deliver five star service, even if they charge Ritz prices -- but none of this speaks very well for the Disneyland Paris hotels. It's probably if unfortunately true that Disneyland Paris' hotels deliver the least bang for your buck of all the world's Disney resorts. As Smurfy said, the best business strategy is to deliver just a little more than people expect, so they're pleasantly enough surprised to return without hesitation. No experienced traveler would say they felt this way after a Newport Bay Club stay.

[speedpacket]

In all fairness Speedpacket your talking about the hotel as if its 5 star... but to my understanding its not.

I have been to loads of hotels all over Europe. Only 2 have ever delivered my luggage to my room, both of those were 5 star (Marriott Brussels and the 5 star deluxe Don Pedro in Lisbon)

Its a sad that you paid so much, but just because its a Disney Hotel you shouldnt expect a 4 star to compare to a 5 star no matter what the price is. At the end of the day you got everything on that list.

I can understand you might be upset that it wasnt what you expected from the price you paid, but glass no matter how finely cut is still glass, you cant just make it into a diamond.

I'm not comparing 4 to 5-star.  I'm comparing 500 EUR to 500 EUR.
I don't understand why people won't see it.  Also, don't think of me as someone who doesn't know what you can expect from Disney.  We've been going for 15 years, always had very good experiences, and this time they screwed up.  Big time.
If it was my first time, I would understand your comments, but it's not, and I've had far better experiences.  Even for a 4 star hotel, as it indeed is, they charge too much, and give too little service.

Even for a 4 star hotel, it's not fair to offer better breakfast to people paying less.  It just doesn't add up, and I don't see why you can't see that.

I would settle for glass, as that is what we can expect, but then at least the glass should be clean and polite, and remain glass when you upgrade; now it went down to paper.